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M4- Ics, King Arms or G&P...what is better?
Posted: 01 Jul 2009, 11:49
Can anyone recomend me what is better ?
Posted: 01 Jul 2009, 11:58
What kind of M4 do you want?
For Berget, I had the King Arms M7A1... superb little gun, got a lot of good comments for it. It is a CQB AEG so not much Power stock.
ICS Guns have Rotary Hop and Split Gearbox, which is very nice too.
Posted: 01 Jul 2009, 14:23
I suggest you stay away from ICS, their split gearbox may be nice but they are in no way compatible to any parts on the market, only ICS. Today VFC has the best M4's on the market, King Arms and G&P following. I also suggest WGC Custom (their replicas are based on G&P but way better assembley) M4 if you find it in stock. You won't be making a mistake if you buy M4 from any of those four manufacturers I mentioned.
Posted: 14 Jul 2009, 10:39
Here in Russia we call ICS as "I see ASS". Becouse of problems in working and tuning, and parts, of course. Many tune-masters even don't want work with ICS brand at all.
GP is good variant. It has base with 120 m/s, solid body (in differ from Classic Army, GP body doesn't loose it's paint so fast), good gearbox (i have fired more then 50k bbs with 145m/s tune on this box, it still doesn't break, now there are 155m/s), good engine M120 (especially in competition with CA), witch easely run my sp150 spring now on 9.9V LiFePo4.
Posted: 14 Jul 2009, 19:28
I know I'd take a G&P or KA if I was in the market for an AR-15 variant.
I have worked on both, and I liked what I saw.
I personally think G&P is made a little bit better than KA, but the downside is the power in their stock form; they have to be downgraded. Not a problem for me personally, but it's why I don't recommend them to new players.
Posted: 14 Jul 2009, 20:31
I have a KA Troy M4! Very satisfied with it, i can really recommend it.
Posted: 15 Jul 2009, 14:00
I bought a King Arms M4 before Berget 7 so I would have a similar gun like the rest of my squad.
When I first opened the box the screw inside stock tube wasn't properly secured and the whole stock was loose. I fastened the screw.
Then I tried to charge the weapon to access the hop-up dial. The charging handle was stuck. I took the gun apart and discovered that the fake bolt (which is a thin metal plate) was crooked and that's why the cocking handle got stuck. I got rid off the fake bolt.
Then I tried to insert one of my Milspex regular magazines. It didn't fit. As didn't the rest of them (I bought 12 for the gun). I took the gun apart and filed the the magazine well smooth, it had these bumps to support the magazine I guess. All other M4's that I checked didn't have these bumps (Classic Army, G&P). The original King Arms hi-cap worked fine though.
I finally got to test the gun, it seemed shoot fine in my kitchen. Then I took it to a game. Range was 20 meters, no matter how much you adjusted the hop-up dial. I took the gun apart and replaced the original hop-up rubber and smaller rubber part with Systema ones.
This time I test fired the gun outside before I took it to a game. When I shot all BB's veered to the right. I took the gun apart in inspected the hop-up closely, the plastic part that applies the pressure was uneven. Then I chronoed the gun, it shot ~85m/s.
Berget 7 came and went, I played with my Real Sword Type 56-1 because I didn't like my M4 at all.
After Berget I replaced all the internals with superior D-boys products and put the gun on sale.
In short, I think King Arms quality control sucks, at least it did with my gun. I won't buy another King Arms product, ever. I heard a nasty rumor in Berget that King Arms Colts are actually manufactured by AGM.
So, buy a G&P or a Jing Gong Colt instead.
PS. The King Arms externals were fine, real(?) markings and all.
Posted: 16 Jul 2009, 18:29
Yes the new Jing Gong M4A1 DX or full metal version what ever you prefer is just outstandig. The stock gearbox and internals are way better than the G&P ones, but G&P has way better metal parts, and finish.
Posted: 26 Jul 2009, 21:57
King Arms is best.
Have M4 SR16 now.. great body, all the marks, very sturdy! Interior was tempered and some parts replaced (guarder bore-up kit and nozzle, M120 spring, GP piston).
G&P lovely exterior, but low quality body (tends to brake quickly if stressed). Had SR25 from GP: gearbox is best qualilty - very hard alloy, gearbox interior very high quality. Had to take it appart and grease and shimm it well.. then it works like a Swiss clock
Good GP piston.
Problems with hop-up chamber- bad feed, jams, etc.
ICS I have no personal experience.. my friend that works in an airsoft distributor company, tells me to stay away.. if you mean serious business. I don't know about ICS top quality.
Still for the money value I would recommend D-Boys.
And every AS gun you have to completly open and check for problems, tighten screws, properly shimm and grease complete gearbox.
Maybe Marui is exceptional
but I would not say than 100%
Posted: 18 Aug 2009, 14:35
I have a jing gong m4 cqb.
is that somthing to run around with on berget XD:P
Posted: 18 Aug 2009, 14:51
I had a TM M3Super90 as main gun at last berget so your JG should work too.
Posted: 18 Aug 2009, 14:58
hehe okay thats good news:P
Posted: 05 Oct 2009, 19:43
i own an ICS since winter 2004 (first editon). its not a gun for beginners.
regarding the upgrade of mechbox its actually pretty simple. the lower part must be original (costs around 40€ and its assembled), everything else its tunable. mine held 280 pdi.
the hop casing must also be original, but the rubber should either be black CA or blue madbull.
its body is very sturdy and after 5 years of abuse its still feels like new (cant remember how many times i fell on barrel, at one time i slept over the gun for the whole night...).
downsize: it consumes a lot of energy so a hi-capacity battery is needed
it held all of the RR events (6) and two bergets (5 and 7).
i also recommend the g&p products (have m16/a2). the guns look great, but the physical attributes are somewhat weak (compared to ics, and the upgrades are a bitch (cuzz theyre expensive). but G&Ps work like a swiss clock after theyre tweaked.
for berget events just take the gun which operates steady
btw ICS has the reqiured markings for germany (the f pentagon and inscription 6mm caliber) printed on both sides of the lower reciever
Posted: 30 Nov 2009, 14:44
I totaly forgot about this topic, thanks anyway for your opinions, i ended up buying a M4 CQBR MAX works like magic
Where the idea that i was a beginner?
Anyway thanks for the feedback.
Posted: 30 Nov 2009, 19:53
You've ended up with Systema, nice! Congrats.