Radios

Discuss about all kinds of radio`s sutable for airsoft games.

Radios

Postby Iron Man » Sun 15 Feb, 2015 01:02

Hello everyone.
Me and a friend of mine signed up as recon for this years Berget, and a requirrement for that is to have radios.
We're two norwegians, and here you ain't allowed to own a puxing 888 radio, so we've been looking for some subistutions, but as the radio amateurs we are.

Could someone please give a short list of the optimal setups for a reasonable price? Up to around 300£. Is it possible?
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Re: Radios

Postby L4gi » Sun 15 Feb, 2015 01:42

You can get a decent radio for well under 100 USD. Im pretty sure the specific radio model is not "banned" in your country, its just everything in the UHF frequency range that requires a permit. Its the same case in pretty much all of the northern EU countries(Finland atleast). You basically have 2 options. Find somewhere inside the EU where they sell it and have that shipped to you. Pretty sure you'll get it delivered just fine, since its inside the EU. Option 2 is ordering it from China/HK, select DHL or something similar as the courier and hope it comes through.

As far as I understand a permit is required to use the radio, not to own one. You can program pretty much all UHF radios to whatever channel you use, so for games inside your country you can just set up PMR channels, turn on low output power and youre pretty much set. For international games or places when its "allowed" to use other frequencies, you adjust accordingly. Now im not condoning illegal activities of any kind cause we are all law abiding citizens... but you know :wank:

www.409shop.com is the best place in HK to get stuff from. They have an absolutely enormous selection of stuff, fast shipping and decent customer service.

Whichever you choose, make sure its a UHF radio for 400-470(480 is fine aswell) frequency range. Getting a programming cable is a good idea aswell.

My team uses these: http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=103380
- Good quality for a piece of Chinese electronics
- Kenwood 2pin plug
- Battery change is fast and "high capacity" batteries are available
- Takes SMA-female antennas(If you want the optimal antenna for berget, get one which is intended for the 435mhz frequency range. You can find them at 409shop aswell.

Puxing 888k: http://www.409shop.com/409shop_product.php?id=122743

Generally speaking, Puxing and Wouxun make decent products.
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Re: Radios

Postby baracken » Sun 15 Feb, 2015 15:50

You could buy the puxxing 777 that one just has the uhf 430-470 (something like that). I had it before I got the 888k.


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Re: Radios

Postby Burger » Sat 21 Feb, 2015 20:28

Will my Puxing PX-777 VHF 136 - 174 Mhz AFU be usable at Berget, or should I invest in something else?
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Re: Radios

Postby L4gi » Sat 21 Feb, 2015 21:01

Berget "official" channels are on UHF frequencies, so you need something that is in the 400-470mhz frequency range.
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Re: Radios

Postby Burger » Sun 22 Feb, 2015 23:06

So a cheap Baofeng could do the job? Like this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/121155301324

It says UHF 400-520MHz.

And sorry, Im still a complete radio-noob.
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Re: Radios

Postby L4gi » Sun 22 Feb, 2015 23:58

Yup.
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Re: Radios

Postby Tiger_1 » Tue 24 Feb, 2015 11:29

But berget official channels are for command level coms. Meaning, your platoon commander and up. So if you are not in a leadership pos, you don't really need a radio for those freq. they are not for internal squad coms. And Berget provides radioes for command level officers.
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Re: Radios

Postby Miksu » Thu 07 Jan, 2016 03:17

If you have enough money and you are ready to buy radios that work on their own frequency (means that u cannot use them with other type of radios) the PRC-343 is your choice for team radios :wink: Better known as Bowman, PRR, Selex, Marconis, H4855 etc... Those radios work on 2.4 Ghz frequency which is the same as wifi frequency. Means that it is free to use atleast in Finland and i believe in many other EU countries aswell. It also have 256 different channels to choose from so the possibility that u r going to be in the same channel with some other squad is small, very small. Those radios are also real deal things used by many armed forces all over the world, so u dont need to worry about breaking one in airsoft (or milsim). They sell mostly between 150€-250€ per one unit which include radio itself, ptt module, antenna, headset and sometimes pouch or wireless ptt button which u can pair with the radio so u can keep your radio for example on your shoulder and your ptt button on your belt (if u want to). We tried the range of those last time in B13 and we were able to talk flawlessly from one side to other in GCT base. In woods the range is enough for small 4-6 ppl squad to operate. The voice quality is second to none if all your squad members use headsets that are in good condition. Almost every headset works, but sometimes the mic boom is kind of dead so the mic doesnt stay close enough your mouth and your voice is very quiet to others. You can fix this by adding tape or something similar to the boom so it stays where it should. Mic also counters very well other noices so the voice is like i said very good. Also when everyone use same high quality radio and headset the transmitting volume is the same to everyone. Not first or last time u set up you radio volume to good level with one guy and then some other start talking to you over radio with different radio/headset setup and your ears start bleeding because his mic is super boosted versus the other guy u just talked before.

Headset itself is in my opinion very comfortable because it is open so you still have pretty good situation awareness, it also doesnt melt your ear at mid summer (like peltors do). And if needed it is designed to be able to wear under active hearing protection (like peltors).

This thing also eats normal AA batteries so you can get them from anywhere. Manufacturer says they last 24hours on operational use (depends on temperature) and for us they last atleast 24hours, if i remember right we did two days with one pair of batteries and we used them a lot.

I attached there a picture of my radio setup below. I am using there Selex PRR to handle squad communications and then i have Baofeng UV-5R (these days with bigger battery and 70cm whip antenna relocated to my back) to operate on command level coms if needed. To transmit to my squad members i used wireless ptt button located to my platecarrier and to translate to command level i press lower button from my Selex PRR. I can use UV-5R also to communicate with PMR radios, but they r mostly over populated in berget so i dont mid to listen those at all.
Image
And because i know some one is going to shoot me a question about how it is possible to connect your UHF/VHF radio to Selex PRR i can tell you those double ptt units r not very rare but i could say they r rare. And they r mostly on sale with the 7pin clansman cable connector which is not compatible with anything else than old clansman radios. So if u want to connect it to your vhf radio u need to find a wizard to change the connector for you (unless you are wizard yourself, if so please contact me asap :D ). My connectors are now HiRose so it is easy to do adapter from hirose to kenwood 2pin for example. Also hirose connector is small enough to route thruu molle webbing.

And last thing is that the best place to buy these radios is suprisingly ebay. You can try to find them easily with words selex, prr, H4855, bowman or prc-343.
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Re: Radios

Postby JKangas » Thu 07 Jan, 2016 07:42

Miksu, how long is the approximate range in dense (wet) woodland? How about if you are lying down i.e. no line of sight to teammates, or acting as forward guard away from your team?

I'm just curious because even ordinary PMR transmissions get damped down if the radio is surrounded by sweaty operator bodyparts and/or ground...and microwave spectrum used by marconis is absorbed much better.

edit: I think I have said this before, but key to successfully using PMRs as team radios in Berget is squelch. Set it high enough so your radio will only pick up close-by i.e. loud transmissions, and save your ears from the constant roger-beep spamming from distant radios.
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Re: Radios

Postby Miksu » Thu 07 Jan, 2016 13:02

JKangas wrote:Miksu, how long is the approximate range in dense (wet) woodland? How about if you are lying down i.e. no line of sight to teammates, or acting as forward guard away from your team?

I'm just curious because even ordinary PMR transmissions get damped down if the radio is surrounded by sweaty operator bodyparts and/or ground...and microwave spectrum used by marconis is absorbed much better.


I have not noticed any huge differences under different conditions. The Manufacturer promises range of 500 meters in open terrain and through three floors of building. And i have find out it is pretty accurate promise. Small objects in line of sight do not effect much to range and u can hear your team mates thru little bumps in terrain (like lying down in fox hole). The transmitting power is 50mW and it is using Direct Sequence Spread Spectrum Modulation at 2.4Ghz if that says anything to you, if not u can try to search for the more specific answer for terrain effect in that kind of spread spectrum.

Also one thing to mention is that the engineer of this radio is made it to impossible for the user to place this radio unit very low on his rig because the headset wire is very short. So the radio is only possible to mount on upper chest or at the shoulder so you have enough wire to turn your head around. First i did not like this feature at all because i was not used to have radio on that high on my rig. But after i think it a little i figured out that if the cable would be longer, every one would put the radios down on their rigs and reduce the range of the radio noticeable. I know there is small goose neck antennas existing but i haven't never seen them in use. Also the wireless ptt button will give you a little bit of freedom, since its range is around 2 meters so you can put it anywhere in your rig. I tried to run it in my weapon but there it was a bit too clumsy.
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Re: Radios

Postby kjsaw » Thu 07 Jan, 2016 20:35

JKangas wrote:Miksu, how long is the approximate range in dense (wet) woodland? How about if you are lying down i.e. no line of sight to teammates, or acting as forward guard away from your team?

I'm just curious because even ordinary PMR transmissions get damped down if the radio is surrounded by sweaty operator bodyparts and/or ground...and microwave spectrum used by marconis is absorbed much better.

edit: I think I have said this before, but key to successfully using PMRs as team radios in Berget is squelch. Set it high enough so your radio will only pick up close-by i.e. loud transmissions, and save your ears from the constant roger-beep spamming from distant radios.


The 2.4Ghz will get 100-300m through the trees without much issue but polarisazation issues exist for both PMR and PRR; Linear polarized anttenas work best when the receiver and the transmitter have the same orientation, if they are rotated 90 degrees in principle the signal will be lost entirely (though of course this is rare since it has to be exaclty 90 degrees). Overall range on the PMR will be better.

The major benefit of the PRR tends to be channel spacing; with 256 channels, and limited range, its easy to find your own space. Secondly lack of interferance from nearby radios; the DSSS Modulation is significantly better than the FM modulation of PMR radios.

The major limitation is the range; We use the PRR in our team, with the squad leaders having the DUAL PTT so we can have the option of longer range comms between squads (or as in your example the forward guard).

Lots of other info about them in a thread from a few years back: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4506
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Re: Radios

Postby kjsaw » Thu 07 Jan, 2016 20:38

Miksu wrote:So if u want to connect it to your vhf radio u need to find a wizard to change the connector for you (unless you are wizard yourself, if so please contact me asap :D ).


Here is some magic a wizard once wrote down: http://www.airsoftguns.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23600
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Re: Radios

Postby Miksu » Fri 08 Jan, 2016 18:59

kjsaw wrote:
Miksu wrote:So if u want to connect it to your vhf radio u need to find a wizard to change the connector for you (unless you are wizard yourself, if so please contact me asap :D ).


Here is some magic a wizard once wrote down: http://www.airsoftguns.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=23600


I need to start study Swedish language right away or hire some one to translate those stories for me. I know google translate exist, but sometimes it can miss lead you a lot. Can you tell me is there a wiring diagram to double ptt module in that forum post? I have find few from internet but nobody hasn't confirmed those :( And my cable ends have been modded in States long time ago.
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