Turning against friendly units

General information about our next game summer 2016.

Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby pekezu » Thu 20 Oct, 2016 19:39

Unlucky it seems that asymmetric warfare was quite a priviledge for the red side. At least last year. Instead the blue forces seemed to have the role of a "modest hero" just trying to fight with honor and respect. Of course I'm not talking individually about every player but more like how it seemed in the eyes of a villager. Or did the blue side have some "Dr. White" or "Eagle" on their side creating drugs of love and friendship?

"Now you are exposed to a very dangerous drug which makes you wanna drop your gun and hug and kiss everyone around. Draw peace signs to your faces and dance around the bonfire."
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby vinni » Fri 21 Oct, 2016 20:12

It's good to be bad.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby fruhest » Sun 23 Oct, 2016 19:28

grasulas wrote:Yea we know it is in the Berget rules what you guys did with the Blue car last year but this dose not mean it was in the spirit of the game, how about we use good old killing, no more cloak and dagger shit ...


What is in the spirit of the game then, only airsofting?

Windi^ wrote: On gunpoint, no one on their right mind would give any enemy a ride to your own base.

But yeah...

I mean, if I had to choose between getting my brains blown out or driving my vehicle, I don't think the choice would be as clear as "noone in their right mind"..


I do not believe that blue-on-blue should be expressely forbidden, but I do think that encouraging it through various magic pills and diseases like previous years isn't really a fun idea.
Bribing, threatening and tricking other people to do things for you, on the other hand, is fun and should be allowed, although that's not really what this thread's about.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Windi^ » Mon 24 Oct, 2016 07:27

fruhest wrote:I mean, if I had to choose between getting my brains blown out or driving my vehicle, I don't think the choice would be as clear as "noone in their right mind"..


One thing I wouldn't do is drive enemies to my own base and that way get my brothers in arms shot. And as a bonus, get my brains blown out... Hell, I would drive. In to a fucking tree and taking as many bastards with me a possible.

But as I said, the problem was that most of the players considered this kind of a situation being impossible. Even if this has happened before, most of the players seemed to be pretty unaware of it. That is why I'm saying that make a clear rule about it so the HQ, players etc knows that something like this can or can't be done. This way players can act accordingly. With unclear rules you just create situations where players starts accusing each other of cheating just because there is no clear rule about it.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Arradin » Mon 24 Oct, 2016 11:13

There was a specific incident last year where a player was " mind controlled " into Shooting up his own HQ.

Unluckily for me, i happened to be in the HQ for a completely different reason when this happened, so people assumed ( i don't blame them ) that it was BE Controlled/sanctioned , which is absolutely not true.

Sometimes you just have to ask yourself, is this good for the game, or is it good only for the people involved ( in this case only 2 people got anything out of it. ).

In the end, Blue on blue ( Acting against your own team ) is not in good spirit at all.

Now - before anyone states the obvious.. YES there are good reasons to have blue on blue at times for LARP reasons. A prime example is execution of a person that disobeys orders, is a traitor, or something of the sort. But that doesnt hurt anyone, the player that is assassinated will go on with his/her own thing... While shooting up an entire HQ will have an enormous impact of the entire game for both sides.

In the end, Things like Hypnosis, Mind control, Truth serums etc is just an easy way out to get a huge impact in form of action or information that doesnt come with any risk but the reward is huge. it is also a way to go around the rules ( Even if not written specificly ) , therefor the rules will rewritten to make it more clear.

Bottom line is that LARP is something to make the game more flavourfull, bring another line of immersion for everyone involved or not involved , but it should and will not be forced on anyone, directly or indirecly.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Ford » Mon 24 Oct, 2016 18:06

We had one accident(we had a lot) with "Red on Red" in particular on red side, where basicly alot of high chiefs got shot. I think that all HQ stop working at that moment.
Thats what happens when we argue about Money.(red comand work like orcs, u have to show power :D )
But we laught our asses of.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby flix » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 11:31

If it's for LARP i would say it should be allowed.

A few of us in the red team on BE14 had a great opportunity on friday evening/night to poison the watersupply in the blue base that would have taken out a lot of people that drank Berget-supplied water (from the taps) and created (larp) chaos in the blue base. But we got a "no go" from GM:s. It would have happen in a real war if we got the opportunity, so it should have been allowed in the game aswell.

That said, LARP in airsoft makes the game more real.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Arradin » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 12:46

flix wrote:If it's for LARP i would say it should be allowed.

A few of us in the red team on BE14 had a great opportunity on friday evening/night to poison the watersupply in the blue base that would have taken out a lot of people that drank Berget-supplied water (from the taps) and created (larp) chaos in the blue base. But we got a "no go" from GM:s. It would have happen in a real war if we got the opportunity, so it should have been allowed in the game aswell.

That said, LARP in airsoft makes the game more real.


Yes, Outlaws wanted to do the exact same thing first night, and it was a no go because it would be a complete game changer and would FORCE larp on the entire Blue team, which only would cause more harm than good.

EDIT:
The Blues never had a "water supply" that could be posisoned. The idea came from the Civilian Town which both had a "water well" ( That noone tried to do anything with ) and also a Power Generator ( That got blown up twice ) .

It was not fair to have something happen that is a complete game changer, which is something that blue never knew anything about and never could defend themselves against.
going up to blue commander and say " Your water is poisoned ", without beforehand telling him that someone possibly could poison the water is not an option, and i am sure that red team would agree if the roles were reversed.

However, the ideas are fantastic, and something simular "may" be included next year :)
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby flix » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 13:01

Yes, Outlaws wanted to do the exact same thing first night, and it was a no go because it would be a complete game changer and would FORCE larp on the entire Blue team, which only would cause more harm than good.


I know, we dragged them along on the plan and needed them for the drugs to "posion" the water with :oops:
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Windi^ » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 15:45

I would also consider changing the "good guy, bad guy" situation a bit. This is airsoft and LARP, and most of the guys wants to be bad. Then you have the blue team that has to try to be nice with the people in town, who almost everyone wants to, for example, poison the blue team's water supply. Then you have red who doesn't give a shit, they do what they want. How much easier it is to buy the guys to the bad side? Since almost everyone wants to be that bad guy. This causes the problem, the blues don't want to larp since almost all of them ends up they being back stabbed. Honestly, the LARP issues with the townies last year I was involved with, ended up in back stabbing apart from one.

Either make it work, or don't give the blues "be nice to the towns people" crap anymore, since it's not gonna work out.
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby L4gi » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 15:57

Maybe its our turn to put everyone in the church and blow it up? :D
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby flix » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 17:39

I've played as Blue aswell. That be nice to the townies isn't worth a crap. In larp+airsoft games no one is nice for long. So just treat everyone as hostile and you dont get backstabbed. But you dont have to shoot everyone at first sight. Its a difference between treat everyone as hostile and shooting at first sight :D
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Arradin » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 17:48

Windi^ wrote:I would also consider changing the "good guy, bad guy" situation a bit. This is airsoft and LARP, and most of the guys wants to be bad. Then you have the blue team that has to try to be nice with the people in town, who almost everyone wants to, for example, poison the blue team's water supply. Then you have red who doesn't give a shit, they do what they want. How much easier it is to buy the guys to the bad side? Since almost everyone wants to be that bad guy. This causes the problem, the blues don't want to larp since almost all of them ends up they being back stabbed. Honestly, the LARP issues with the townies last year I was involved with, ended up in back stabbing apart from one.

Either make it work, or don't give the blues "be nice to the towns people" crap anymore, since it's not gonna work out.


You will be quite happy about how it is going to work out with B15 then... ;)
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby Arradin » Thu 27 Oct, 2016 17:49

flix wrote:I've played as Blue aswell. That be nice to the townies isn't worth a crap. In larp+airsoft games no one is nice for long. So just treat everyone as hostile and you dont get backstabbed. But you dont have to shoot everyone at first sight. Its a difference between treat everyone as hostile and shooting at first sight :D


You mean like during B13, where blue kept using artillery strikes on the town ? ;)
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Re: Turning against friendly units

Postby flix » Fri 28 Oct, 2016 05:54

Arradin wrote:
flix wrote:I've played as Blue aswell. That be nice to the townies isn't worth a crap. In larp+airsoft games no one is nice for long. So just treat everyone as hostile and you dont get backstabbed. But you dont have to shoot everyone at first sight. Its a difference between treat everyone as hostile and shooting at first sight :D


You mean like during B13, where blue kept using artillery strikes on the town ? ;)


I think that was blue HQ's way of handeling a complex situation :P

From my years of larping in airsoft you see a clear pattern. Everyone has a secred agenda. Sometimes yours and theirs align and something can happen that is good for both. But most of the times people tend to die. F.x. last year I know a lot of the red players made an effort to be nice to the townies but ended up shot in the back on saturday. So it really doesn't matter if you are red or blue. Watch your back in town. And it's also important to remember that the game is only a few days long. That makes all the encounters more "intense" since people want to do more over a short period of time. Regardless of it's the NAF rangers, UPIR ghost or people larping.
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